huizi and zhuangzi about gourds

It was big and all, but because it was so useless I finally just smashed it to pieces., Zhuangzi said, You are certainly stupid when it comes to using big things. Ironic, then, that our representative of logic, logician Huizi, is not capable of such creativity. Zhuangzi helps us to reckon with the fact that we necessarily come to the world with a certain perspective there is no view from nowhere but we are invited through Zhuangzis stories to get out of that perspective and see that of others. What follows is that the expression wuqing should not be identified as a doctrine of nonemotion. Instead, wuqing implies that Zhuangzi advises us to lead a life of tranquility, calmness, and stillness. For example, 1) the situations are often highly unrealistic, beyond what normal, real-world counterfactual reasoning would get one to; 2) the characters involved have abilities or disabilities that few if any humans have and sometimes3; and 3) the situations have a way of making a point or a position more memorable than a plainly stated proposition4. 2003. WebZhuangzi is criticizing his friend Huizi for smashing giant gourds because he couldnt find a conventional use for them. Introduction: Emotions and the Conceptual History of Qing . In Love and Emotions in Traditional Chinese Literature, edited by Halvor Eifring. Indianapolis: Hackett. Oxford: Oxford University Press. Even though the lessons are in story form, that doesnt mean that they are easy to decipher. For example, we might want to interpret Master Chariots story in light of other thingsZhuangzi says about the natural transformation of things25 and conclude that Zhuangzi is trying to say that transformation (whether an arm into a rooster, or life into death) is nothing to fear or avoid. 2015. Some of these purposes include helping us to: 1)better understand a concept by artificially constructing a scenario that makes certain features more salient 2) think about where we stand on a specific issue 3) consider alternative perspectives in a given situation and 4) see in what way a philosophers many thoughts could be made coherent or reasonable. Or consider the story of Huizi and the yard-long gourd that was too big to be a ladle so Huizi smashes it because it was useless.20 Zhuangzi then tells a story about a smart traveler who knew how to make good use of an ointment for chapped hands. crits de Matre Wen , . Springer Nature remains neutral with regard to jurisdictional claims in published maps and institutional affiliations. Please read this book to learn how to take advantage of the abundant language resources and opportunities for communication that surround you. Eifring, Halvor. New York: Seven Bridges Press. 3 0 obj crits de Matre Wen , . The Complete Work of the Zhuangzi . This combined with Zhuangzis penchant for irony, the fact that Zhuangzi alludes to fictitious characters and texts, and even takes real figures like Confucius and attributes to the sage things we cant be sure Confucius actually said all of this can make it hard to know what exactly he thinks of the people and things he writes about. Eno, Robert, trans. Chinese and Western philosophy in dialogue, Anecdotes and thought experiments in Zhuangzi and Western philosophy. https://www.academia.edu/35172330/Zhuangzis_Doctrine_of_No_Emotions_forthcoming_in_Dao_Companion_to_the_Philosophy_of_the_Zhuangzi_Kim_Chong_Chong_and_Kai_Yuan_Cheng_eds_final_draft (last accessed on October 12, 2020). Mair, Victor H., trans. Zhuang Zi . Zhuangzi does write that Master Chariot is of sound mind. We show that these peaceful attitudes are associated with the idea of wuwei in the Zhuangzi. https://scholarworks.iu.edu/dspace/handle/2022/23427 (last accessed on November 27, 2020). He was down to earth and had a tongue in cheek sense of humour. Yet he commits this very sin, and all because he feels he reached a valid conclusion. First I will discuss Western thought experiments and a few reasons that have been given for and against using these tools to acquire knowledge. The debate between Zhuangzi and Huizi has profound epistemological significance, however, the main body of their debate comprises logical inferences and refutations. He really has convinced himself that his knowledge and mode of thinking is complete! Such a tree has grown to a ripe old age by adapting itself to its environment. . The great gourd. Chuangtse . 1891. At other times, he presents a story and just leaves it more up to the reader to interpret. 2000. On Anger: An Essay on Confucian Moral Psychology. In Returning to Zhu Xi: Emerging Patterns within the Supreme Polarity, edited by David Jones and Jinli He. The debate between Zhuangzi and Huizi has profound epistemological significance, however, the main body of their debate comprises logical inferences and refutations. The Tradition of Emotive Writing in the Zhuangzi and Its Echoes in Later Generations. Frontiers of Philosophy in China 10.3: 340352. Zhuangzi. Google Scholar. The Ethics of Responding Properly: The Notion Qing in Early Chinese Thought. In Love and Emotions in Traditional Chinese Literature, edited by Halvor Eifring. Das wahre Buch vom sdlichen Bltenland. Changsha : Hunan Renmin Chubanshe . Napoli: Universit degli Studie di Napoli LOrientale.. Are happy feelings and experiences all that humans are ultimately after? 14Perhaps one of the most marked differences between a classic thought experiment in Western analytic philosophy and a story in Zhuangzi is that in the former, there is a clear question being asked. - 69.163.152.102. 1968. The Zhuangist Views on Emotions. Asian Philosophy 28.1: 5567. Zhuangzi writes: Suddenly, Master Chariot got sick. Master Chariot is one of many characters Zhuangzi discusses who is odd, for lack of a better word, and perhaps Zhuangzi would like us to see that Master Chariot, as well as other unique characters in our communities, are people who still have a voice and should be paid attention to because they may have important things to say about living naturally and freely. Huizi and Zhuangzi about gourds; the story of Cook Ding (sometimes called Butcher Ding); and the story of Wheelwright Pian. Price excludes VAT (USA) 1993. 1920. This was in the introduction to my book, The Linguist, A Personal Guide to Language Learning which I wrote a few years ago. 19To be fair, I should note that Zhuangzi doesnt always leave the reader in the dark as to what a story is about or what he himself thinks of the characters involved. The Happiness of Fish A Taoist Tale, Huizi said, Youre not a fish how do you know what fish enjoy?, Zhuangzi said, Youre not me, so how do you know I dont know what fish enjoy?, Huizi said, Im not you, so I certainly dont know what you know. Jinan : Qilu Shushe . Lynn, Richard John. Ren, Songyao. Dschuang-Dsi. Were There Inner Chapters in the Warring States? Leiden: Brill. 8 Jackson has actually since changed his position on the thesis of physicalism and he no longer thinks its false. vres De Tchoang-Tzeu. % 1957. This admittedly is a different kind of similarity, one involving the similar, Jackson has actually since changed his position on the thesis of physicalism and he no longer think, Roy Sorensen 1992 has a discussion of several criticisms on the use of thought experiments, stories, This is uncharacteristic of Western thought experiments where the philosopher presents the imagined, One could, for example, think here of Zhuangzis famous butterfly dream that concludes chapter 2 of. He makes possible travel across great bodies of waterthe Jungian symbolic unknown and unconsciousthereby, he is able to go places and do things priorly inaccessible. But Mary has never actually seen anything colored because she lives in a black and white world. 2018. It is the acknowledgement of his ignorance which give him a reason to better himselfbecause he knows just how far he is from who he could become. I cannot stress enough the importance of being an independent individual in order to achieve success in language learning. Guiyang : Guizhou Renmin Chubanshe . The maker of things is really knotting me up.Master Sacrifice said, Do you dislike it?He said, Not at all. ______, trans. Puett, Michael J. On my reading, Zhuangzis Most scholars have understood qing in this exchange as referring to feelings or emotions. We take issue with such readings. 2010. 3 In fact, in Zhuangzis case, the featured voices are often non-human. Nature, Myth, Realism, The science of futures. Zhuangzi, the Taoist philosopher, lived in. Sorensen, R., 1992, Thought Experiments, New York, Oxford University Press. Dao This is a preview of subscription content, access via your institution. Different disciplines have their different tools for doing so. Huizi took the utility of gourds as being their usefulness as containers or drinking vessels, and so concluded that the gourds in question being too large for this purpose had no utility; Zhuangzi pointed out that there is a perspective that Huizi had not considered -- utility not as a container but as a raft -- from which this is not so. endobj Van Norden, B., 1996, Competing interpretations of the inner chapters of the Zhuangzi, Philosophy East West, University of Hawaii Press. Dordrecht: Springer. 16Piggy-backing on this, after a clear question is raised through the thought experiment, there is often a claim being advanced by the originator of the experiment. And most of all just enjoy yourself! Beijing : Zhongguo Huaqiao Chubanshe . Huizi said to Zhuangzi, This old tree is so crooked and rough that it is useless for lumber. In these classic thought experiments, and many others, there is a clear question being asked. Beijing : Shangwu Yinshuguan . The thought experiments here and conclusions about the imaginary cases are taken to help defend a certain stance (e.g., against utilitarianism, against strong artificial intelligence) that the philosopher wants to take. WebAnother storyHuizi and Zhuangzi about gourds starts when the king of Weis large gourdgives Huizi gourd seeds. The video below (Flight from the Shadow) is an example of the type of teaching he engaged in. He is trapped within the boundaries of his own preconceptions. Lenehan, Katia. Paris: ditions de lencyclopdie des nuisances. I filled it with liquid, but it was not firm enough to lift. His language did not hit his target the intent to make sense of things. This suggests that Zhuangzi saw Hui Shi as caught in a paradox. Insofar as these are aims in philosophy, Zhuangzi might do better in prompting these in his reader than one who puts forth a self-standing thought experiment advancing a particular thesis. Are we just engaging in irresponsible moral epistemology in using hypothetical thought experiments and taking them, at best, as tools of persuasion to belief in a certain claim and, at worst, as grounds of evidence for a position? Now you had these gigantic gourds. 2016. And insofar as part of what makes something good philosophy is that it sparks wonder and further questioning, Zhuangzis stories might even do better than self-standing thought experiments. Wandering on the Way. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Zhuangzi and Huizi were strolling along the dam of the Hao Waterfall when Zhuangzi said, See how the minnows come out and dart around where they please! Shun, Kwong-loi. Although some of Zhuangzis stories may fail as good thought experiments by Western standards, due to the lack of clear questions and positions advanced, I submit that in other ways, his stories are not less effective in encouraging readers to question their own views and to consider alternative perspectives. 2011. The Status of Qing in Philosophical Texts of Ancient China. In Expressions of States of Mind in Asia, edited by Paolo Santangelo. Our text offers three additional examples: Nie Ques conversation with Wang Ni; Huizi and Zhuangzi about gourds; the story of Cook Ding (sometimes called Butcher Ding); and the story of Wheelwright Pian. 2003. Kjellberg, Paul, trans. Qing (Emotions) in Pre-Buddhist Chinese Thought. In Emotions in Asian Thought: A Dialogue in Comparative Philosophy, edited by Joel Marks and Roger T. Ames. 2015. Lenehan, Katia. Thomson, J., 1985, The Trolley Problem, Yale Law Journal, 94: 1395-1415. This word is also used in the title of the first chapter of the Zhuangzi: Free and Easy Wandering (xiao yao you ). Chai, David. Instead, you worried that it was too wide to scoop into anything, which I guess means the mind of our greatly esteemed master here is still clogged up, occupied with its bushes and branches! (Zhuangzi 7-8). Change). Zhang, Gengguang , trans. He over 2,300 years ago He taught the Tao, or way, an approach to life based on effortlessness and harmony with People who follow their natures and pursue their own path to language learning will be happier and more successful than learners who try meet goals set for them by others. 2002-2022 The Linguist Institute, Inc. All rights reserved. 2001. Saggi in onore di Lucia Pizzo Russo, la neurofenomenologia. Zhuangzi is a master storyteller and he uses that talent to teach important moral Zhuangzi is a master storyteller and he uses that talent to teach important moral and philosophical lessons. This is uncharacteristic of Western thought experiments where the philosopher presents the imagined case and then discusses what it implies. WebHuizis truism that Zhuangzi is not a fish shows some appreciation of the problem of SpR, but the ensuing conclusion that Zhuangzi couldnt know fish happiness assumes that HuiZi said to ZhuangZi, "The Prince of Wei gave me a seed of a large-sized kind of gourd. It wasnt that they werent wonderfully big, but they were useless. The Zhuangist Views on Emotions. Asian Philosophy 28.1: 5567. Do you divert the trolley or not? 2010. Avanguardia, cinema, immagini, social objects from intentionality to documentality, numero speciale, supplemento al n. 55| 2014, aesthetic experience in the evolutionary perspective, wineworld. Paris: Cathasia, 2e tirage. In this article we focus on the famous dialogue between Zhuangzi and Huizi concerning the question whether or not ren (in particular the shengren ) have qing . 3Of course there is no way in one paper that I could hope to take into consideration the variety of contemporary Western thought experiments and compare them to even half of the fables we find in the Zhuangzi. Leiden: Brill. Dordrecht: Springer. The Status of Qing in Philosophical Texts of Ancient China. In Expressions of States of Mind in Asia, edited by Paolo Santangelo. Well end by analyzing a parablea conversation between logician Huizi and a fictionalize version of Zhuangzi himself: Huizi said to Zhuangzi, The King of Wei gave me the seed of a great gourd. Imaginations wander through a world of Zhuangzis human and non-human characters, but unlike with the Western thought experiments, bringing back observations of such people and situations with the express purpose of better helping and understanding our own lives is not necessarily the point. Anyone you share the following link with will be able to read this content: Sorry, a shareable link is not currently available for this article. Emotion in Pre-Qin Ruist Moral Theory: An Explanation of Dao Begins in Qing. Philosophy East and West 53.2: 271281. 5Thought experiments have long been used in philosophy as a way to raise questions or pursue knowledge through considering hypothetical situations. 2008. The Background of the Mencian Theory of Human Nature. Tsing Hua Journal of Chinese Studies 6.12: 215271. Whereas the trees in the industrial forest are straight and look alike, the crooked tree grew alone, or with a mixture of other trees of different ages and species. WebHuizi said to Zhuangzi, The king of Wei left me the seeds of a big gourd. Do computers understand things the way humans do? It would seem that the virtue of Master Chariot is that he humbly accepts whatever happens to him, and it is the mental (ability to let go) that is more important than the physical. Leiden: Brill. 2018. Zhuangzis Doctrine of No-Emotion (pre-production draft). 2011. Si, L , trans. This article was supported by National Social Sciences Funding (Major Program) of China [Grant No. stream Paris: Cathasia, 2e tirage. Arthur C. Danto e l'ontologia dell'arte, Il Significato Eluso. 2009. To learn about our use of cookies and how you can manage your cookie settings, please see our Cookie Policy. In this sense, though the stories are often fantastic, the book is meant to offer a realistic lesson in the uselessness of trying to figure out life.18 So that might be the message stop trying so hard to understand, to look for a (main) point, to have things to make sense. Ziporyn, Brook, trans. Register to receive personalised research and resources by email. Ma, L., van Brakel, J. Revisiting the Exchange between Zhuangzi and Huizi on Qing. One might also describe this as engaging in Socratic Dialectical thought. 2008. Chong, Kim-chong. Middendorf, Ulrike. PubMedGoogle Scholar. are sufficiently exhaustive to make his conclusion sound. Roy Sorensen 1992 has a discussion of several criticisms on the use of thought experiments, stories, and intuition pumps, as Daniel Dennett calls them. 2004. Overall, Zhuangzi clearly recommends open-minded flexibility as when he scolds Hui Shi for being tied to conventional thinking about how to use giant gourds. Each moment, the opportunity to switch between Huizi and Zhuangzi presents itself. Chuang Tzu. In fact, its hard to think of a thought experiment where the question being asked is not clear. Changsha: Hunan Renmin Chubanshe. Emotions That Do Not Move: Zhuangzi and Stoics on Self-Emerging Feelings. Dao: A Journal of Comparative Philosophy 14.4: 521544. Afterwards, one leaves behind the fantastical elements of the thought experiment and is just left with a proposition about human morality, epistemology, etc. Beyond the Troubled Water of Shifei: From Disputation to Walking-Two-Roads in the Zhuangzi. Changsha : Hunan Renmin Chubanshe . 1When it comes to persuading people to acknowledge a truth or think a certain way, there are many ways that we try to discover and convince each other of the truth. Graham, A. C. 1981. Change is to be welcomed, and nothing should be held onto too tightly, because change itself is the only constant thing. There can be no value in it. In both, finding the message of the work or the intention of its creator is not necessarily the purpose of the piece as much as is engaging with it and walking away with something even if that something is not an understanding of the actual work but rather a broadening of the mind, an interesting question, or a pleasurable experience. A logical analysis of the debate on Hao . clandestine change of argumentative issue, Restore content access for purchases made as guest, 48 hours access to article PDF & online version. 2011. In Readings in Classical Chinese Philosophy, edited by Philip J. Ivanhoe and Bryan W. Van Norden. 2014. Chai, David. Beijing : Zhonghua Shuju . How extraordinary of the maker of things to knot me up like this. Zhuang Zi: De volledige geschriften: Het grote klassieke boek van het Taosme Amsterdam: Uitgeverij Augustus. Zhuangzi. ______, trans. Fraser, Chris. Zhuangzis and Huizis stroll is described as rambling around, which is you () in Chinese. 30Perhaps if only Zhuangzi and others didnt come up with such memorable traps. Zhuangzi - Chapter 1 (Carefree Living) - Huizi's Giant Gords. My back is hunched out. 1981/2001. 2004. 2003. Mair, Victor H., trans. Other times the humans might be in a very ordinary situation, but the humans themselves are altered or have some special background. Indianapolis: Hackett. A true language learner must be like the crooked tree of Zhuangzi, not seeking perfection of form, but prospering by taking advantage of surrounding resources. Master Sacrifice went to ask after him. Zhang, Mosheng, , trans. Lin, Yutang , trans. Such distractions can be left out of fabricated cases so that we can better focus on the relevant moral principles. 2007. First, we demonstrate that, while Huizi probably understands qing as something like feelings or emotions, Zhuangzis view is that having qing is connected One tool a philosopher can use is hypothetical scenarios. Our text offers three additional examples: Nie Ques conversation with Wang Ni; Huizi and Zhuangzi about gourds; the story of Cook Ding (sometimes called Butcher Ding); and the story of Wheelwright Pian. I filled them with water but they werent I will then discuss some of the fictitious anecdotes that appear in the Zhuangzi. All Is Well in the Great Mess. Theory of Non-Emotion in the Zhuangzi and Its Connection to Wei-Jin Poetry. Journal of Chinese Philosophy 40.2: 340354. 2011. https://doi.org/10.1007/s11712-020-09765-6, DOI: https://doi.org/10.1007/s11712-020-09765-6. The Philosophy of Life: A New Reading of the Zhuangzi. Zhuangzis Doctrine of No-Emotion (pre-production draft). At this point one might reasonably ask: why bother stretching peoples imagination? Such thought experiments, if they exist, are probably not considered good (Western) thought experiments. volume20,pages 133148 (2021)Cite this article. Why dont philosophers just state their questions or positions more plainly? 1891. Albany: State University of New York Press. What better carriage? 2001. All Is Well in the Great Mess. Feng, Youlan, trans. This is the dialectical nature of the universe we discussed in the previous analysis, a nature that runs to the bottom of existence itself. 2003. Si, L , trans. Jackson uses this thought experiment to argue that because Mary gains some knowledge the first time she sees red, she didnt know everything to know about color through knowing all the physical facts about color and so, he says, the thesis of physicalism (i.e., the idea that everything is physical) is false.8. Les vres de Matre Tchouang. I planted them, and when they grew, the fruit was a yard across. ______. 13Zhuangzi is known for giving voice to many different creatures humans of all sorts and a host of animals as well. In this article we focus on the famous dialogue between Zhuangzi and Huizi concerning the question whether or not ren (in particular the shengren ) have qing . Dordrecht: Springer. If you are content with the time and abide by the passing, theres no room for sorrow or joy. Cao, Chuji , trans. I further argue that the central concern of the two philosophical personae in the passage Zhuangzi and Huizi is not with the epistemic standards of human judgements (the established view since Hansen, The Relatively Happy Fish), but with the more basic problem of species-specific perspectives. He believes he knows what a gourd is capable of and useful for; and therefore, he believes that his conclusion about his great gourd is correct; therefore, he believes that his trials (filling it, cutting it into a dipper, etc.) Zhuangzi is a master storyteller and he uses that talent to teach important moral and philosophical lessons. Les vres de Matre Tchouang. New York: Seven Bridges Press. Bryan Van Norden and Philip Ivanhoe write of Zhuangzi saying, rather than delivering a message, the Zhuangzi seems to go out of its way to defy understanding. . Such is the happiness of fishes. You not being a fish, said Huizi, how can In the latter case, the focus is on the idea or question raised, which, Ive suggested, is made patently obvious in a good thought experiment. but if its not clear what we are supposed to remember, then whats the point? Sometimes he offers a direct commentary on a certain character or view; other times he doesnt. School of Philosophy, Renmin University of China (Zhe-xue-yuan), Av. Indianapolis: Hackett. First, we demonstrate that, while Huizi probably understands qing as something like feelings or emotions, Zhuangzis view is that having qing is connected with making shifei judgments whereas having no qing means that shifei has no grip on those ren, especially the shengren. Levi, Jean, trans. 2004. 2012. He does this because he knows his logic to be validthat is to say, he knows that his premises and conclusions follow. Chapter One ends with Zhuangzi Reding, Jean-Paul. . 2003. - 95.111.234.200. Napoli: Universit degli Studie di Napoli LOrientale.. Chen, Guying , trans. 2014. Bradenton, FL: BookLocker. Springer Nature remains neutral with regard to jurisdictional claims in published maps and institutional affiliations. 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Albany: State University of New York Press. endobj Huizi believes his knowledge is sufficiently complete as to be capable of using rational deduction to come to only correct answers. 24Alternatively, perhaps Zhuangzi thinks Master Chariot is crazy, and he is inventing a character who seems accepting of such ridiculous things happening as a way of questioning the sanity of a mind that is so calm and unperturbedMaster Chariot then would be an example of how Daoist passivity can go too far. I have never learned as quickly or as enjoyably as I do now on LingQ. Provided by the Springer Nature SharedIt content-sharing initiative, Over 10 million scientific documents at your fingertips, Not logged in 1981/2001. Wang Bi and Xuanxue. In Dao Companion to Daoist Philosophy, edited by Xiaogan Liu. Article Huizi and Zhuangzi about gourds; the story of Cook Ding (sometimes called Butcher Ding); and the story of Wheelwright Pian.
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